new registration rebellion

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Bob Thompson1894
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new registration rebellion

Postby Bob Thompson1894 » April 26th, 2019, 3:14 pm

Just had the email about registering names and paying for the privilege. Are we just going to bow down, or do all forty thousand or so of us just say no to this 'drone tax'?

David Baker
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Re: new registration rebellion

Postby David Baker » April 26th, 2019, 3:47 pm

I just objected on their site... job done!
Only Took 5 minutes.

stuart knowles 1611
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Re: new registration rebellion

Postby stuart knowles 1611 » April 26th, 2019, 5:54 pm

Consultation = 1.We decide what we want to do - 2.Ask the views of interested parties -3. Implement 1

Have to say that I'm very disappointed to see this development, It seems to be a tax on all the law abiding to pay for measures to confront those who will never comply.

When has there ever been an incident where a register of Pilots / Operators would have altered the outcome? If you are the fruitcake who wants to disrupt an airport, I'm pretty sure that you won't be putting your ID onto the drone.

Once upon a time, everyone with dog had to pay for a Licence. It proved nothing, helped nothing, did nothing - I'm not sure how this will be any different except we will all have our pockets picked annually.

After the last airport incident the Press were stoking hysteria

Something must be done...…. Well this is Something... therefore we must do this. Complete Bollox

Bob Thompson1894
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Re: new registration rebellion

Postby Bob Thompson1894 » April 26th, 2019, 6:40 pm

Yep- its easy to register your annoyance, I have vented a bit of spleen... https://consultations.caa.co.uk/finance ... istration/

paul hughes
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Re: new registration rebellion

Postby paul hughes » April 26th, 2019, 7:18 pm

Surely all legal model pilots are on a register already, through the insurers, can the CAA not access this, as police do with car insurance. Those that don't bother insuring aren't going to register anyway. This is just a toy aircraft tax! Bloody conservatives.

Bob Thompson1894
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Re: new registration rebellion

Postby Bob Thompson1894 » April 26th, 2019, 7:22 pm

BMFA offered that, Paul- they got no response.

Steve Mansell
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Re: new registration rebellion

Postby Steve Mansell » April 27th, 2019, 9:27 pm

Interesting to note that the consultation isn't on whether the scheme is acceptable (or effective), but is limited to the charges levied. So objections to the registration scheme will not be considered, (as the requirement for registration has already been passed into law), only objections or comments on the charge will be taken into account. It looks like it's done and dusted and we're lumbered with it come what may.


Steve

Alan Cantwell 1131
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Re: new registration rebellion

Postby Alan Cantwell 1131 » April 28th, 2019, 6:49 am

5 have commented on this, 96, at this time, have viewed , says it all really, lots will roll over and accept this intrusion, it’s not the money, it’s the unfair way the Committee Against Aviation have listened to the LMA, and bmfa, totally ignored what’s been said, and surprised everyone with this intrusion, your being blamed for something that’s not your fault, please fill in the form, and do it sensibly,

Bob Thompson1894
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Re: new registration rebellion

Postby Bob Thompson1894 » April 28th, 2019, 7:36 am

how many will simply refuse to pay? And how many 'lone fliers' will not even know about it? How will it be policed, unless the LMA, BMFA and FPVuk do it for them? My opinion is that the national bodies should not involve themselves with it and leave it up to the individual- then watch it go the way of dog licences.

Ian Reid-Jones
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Re: new registration rebellion

Postby Ian Reid-Jones » April 28th, 2019, 8:17 am

Regulation such as this is useless if it is not policed and enforced. It seems unlikely to me that individual transgressors of the Regs are most unlikely to be apprehended unless reported, identified and witnessed by members of the public. A more likely scenario I can see is that Clubs patches patches receive a visit from the Police in response to a report or complaint from a disgruntled neighbour etc.
The problem at the very root of these new Regulations - the errant or villainous Multirotor operator, is not going to be deterred. We law abiding Model and multi rotor Flyers will bear the cost and inconvenience for no gain.
Last edited by Ian Reid-Jones on April 28th, 2019, 10:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

David Jones
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Re: new registration rebellion

Postby David Jones » April 28th, 2019, 8:27 am

I've filled in the survey and added my twopenneth worth. My thought on this is, unless it is a stipulation of the LMA or BMFA etc, I could refuse to register. What if everybody did the same? This country can't afford to police the streets properly, never mind employing teams to check on all model flying venues. It's just another stealth tax and something to brag about when a Minister is asked "what are the government doing about drones". Codswallop.

Bob Thompson1894
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Re: new registration rebellion

Postby Bob Thompson1894 » April 28th, 2019, 10:03 am

A couple of points here- they have severely overestimated the numbers of pilots, which means it will be underfunded-ergo the price will go up, and second, the registration is now set in law (a bit like leaving the EU) :lol: and all we can object to is the price. To my mind, the only option is civil disobedience, but it means all of us.


stuart knowles 1611
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Re: new registration rebellion

Postby stuart knowles 1611 » April 30th, 2019, 7:21 pm

Having read Rob's column in the new mag, it just makes you wonder where this latest development has come from.
Clearly Rob was not expecting it and assuming that in his discussions with the CAA etc, they haven't mentioned it, - then who the heck is driving this?

Having had time to consider the new proposals, my initial reaction still seems to be the right one. If it comes to pass it will strike right at the core of aeromodelling. It sends the message to all future children and young people that the sky above you is reserved for business use and any thought of recreational use is subject to government sanction. Even control liners are brought into the rules... I don't know how kites have escaped....so far.

I look forward to hearing Robs commentary on the new proposals when he feels it appropriate to say more. I hope that everyone who flys any form of rc vehicle for fun will band together to oppose these measures in the strongest possible terms. Some of the comments that I have read elsewhere about turning our back on the users of multirotors or berating the BMFA and others for 'doing nothing' beggar belief.

Steve Mansell
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Re: new registration rebellion

Postby Steve Mansell » April 30th, 2019, 10:13 pm

I wonder how many flyers will decide to go "off grid", e.g. not registering and rescinding membership of associations so their details aren't available to the Gestapo. The introduction of badly thought through laws just end up alienating otherwise law abiding people, and fail to achieve the intended purpose (in this case I'm not sure what the intended purpose is).

As far as the "user pays" policy, we are not the user as there is no benefit to us.

I think I'll just be an owner of models, as ownership isn't illegal (yet). None of my models record flights, just electrical load and consumption. Another solution is for me to get rid of all my modelling stuff and convert my workshop into a cannabis farm.

Cheers,
Mr Grumpy

Bob Thompson1894
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Re: new registration rebellion

Postby Bob Thompson1894 » May 1st, 2019, 7:09 am

They surely cant access the BMFA/LMA databases without breaking the law, so how on earth do they find anyone to fine? Police raids with riot gear on Little Smelly Lane Recreation Park? They will need to pick their weather, I am a fair weather pilot these days...

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Rob Buckley
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Re: new registration rebellion

Postby Rob Buckley » May 1st, 2019, 8:49 am

Email just gone out to all LMA members, and here it is in case any have missed it. Unfortunate that the Journal went to print just in time to miss all this!

Morning,

Following the recent publication of CAP1775 link here which launched a consultation on the CAA's proposed arrangements for registration fees for operators of unmanned aircraft, the UK model flying associations (BMFA, LMA, SAA & FPVUK) held a meeting last night with advisers.

The text in CAP1775 is far more serious than the issue of registration fees alone. The consultation reveals that key policy decisions (such as age limits, not allowing us to register members on their behalf and repetitive competency requirements) appear to have been imposed on us in the absence of either consultation or the further discussions the DfT/CAA publicly promised earlier this year.

The policies outlined are inconsistent with the EASA Regulations for model flying associations, because they mandate requirements which should instead be subject to negotiation and agreement with us prior to incorporation into our operational authorisation. As the scope of the consultation is limited to the fee arrangements, it does not invite comment on these wider policy issues.

As the CAA/DfT have evaded engagement with us on policy development since the end of 2018 and have now seemingly closed the door on us with CAP1775, we believe that it is now time for members to hold them directly to account.

The document available here summarises the views of the UK Associations, explains what we hoped to achieve and outlines where we believe the CAA/DfT have failed our members, who are the largest single stakeholder group affected by CAP1775 and details what you can do to help.

Please feel free to use this document as part of a response or print and pass to members who have not received this email.

Unfortunately, the issue of the Journal that you have just received went to print before this happened, which is unfortunate timing!

This call to action is just one element of a wider co-ordinated campaign. There is still a long way to go with this and please be assured it is by no means the end of the story.

We need a big response on this and we would urge every member to help us.

Any questions, as ever, please let me know.

Best Regards

Rob Buckley Secretary - Large Model Association
secretary@largemodelassociation.com
LMA Secretary - I've got a reasonable idea where you live!

Steve Mansell
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Re: new registration rebellion

Postby Steve Mansell » May 1st, 2019, 10:09 am

I must comment on the tireless efforts Rob and the committee have put into this on all our behalf, we do this as a hobby and for recreational pleasure.
Many thanks again.
Steve

David Baker
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Re: new registration rebellion

Postby David Baker » May 1st, 2019, 3:34 pm

Surely we can fight this in the law courts as an infringement of our human rights?
If Terrorists can get unlimited legal aid to fight the government....

Bob Thompson1894
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Re: new registration rebellion

Postby Bob Thompson1894 » May 1st, 2019, 3:57 pm

I concur on the efforts made by the committees of both LMA and BMFA.
We can all help, please email your (polite) concerns regarding this to
baroness.vere@dft.gov.uk


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